Author Topic: READ: UTT DECOMPILING, MODIFYING AND SELLING AIA MODELS  (Read 25211 times)

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Offline Andy

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READ: UTT DECOMPILING, MODIFYING AND SELLING AIA MODELS
« on: October 23, 2013, 01:26:22 AM »
This is not a post I wanted to make. I can see myself getting flamed for posting this, even. But whatever. Please read this with an open mind and make your own decisions.  ::confused::

So about a week ago there was a fuss about the POSKY CRJ model being ripped off by UTT. I had a look into it and was very disappointed by what I saw there. So I downloaded the UTT models for the first time and had a comparison between them and some of the models they supplement or replace. This is what I found. The UTT Boeing 737-200 is a modified AI Aardvark 737-200. The UTT Boeing 747-800 is a modified AI Aardvark 747-400.

I spoke with David Rawlins at AIA and he confirmed that he's aware that this UTT 737 is a ripoff of the AIA 732. If he still had any involvement in our hobby he would pursue this, although he does feel there is not much that can be done.

So first a couple of points about the 748.







The Boeing 747-8 is a very different machine than the -400 and you can see that in the model. But the moment you inspect both together, you can see the old AIA parts staring back at you. The nose section is basically the same but they have for some reason modeled the folding cargo nose even on the passenger model. You can see the same basic polygon layout on both, you can tell what's been modified / moved around and what points and vertices have remained the same.
The tail section is where it's at, you can't deny that the tail is the same part, realigned to be more true to the shape of the 747-8.

So that's the tip of the iceberg. Let's look at the 732 now.


The tail section is the same. A couple of vertices have been realigned to better match the shape of the 732, a theme we will find a lot when looking at this model. You can see by the kinks in the cross-section that this is a LAZY rip-off  ::fighting::




After I took this picture I inspected the lower LOD's of the UTT 732. The lower LOD's actually use the original Aardvark tail in it's entirety.


Yet more evidence of the same "kinks" used in both the UTT and the AIA model.


And some more unequivocal truth.




Again the nose was modified so it is more rounded. However you can still make out where the parts are exactly the same, you can make out what's been added, and you can make out what's been removed. If they were different models there would be no comparison at all. I'm sorry but this is disgusting behaviour  ::confused::

There are reliable reports that the MD-11 uses the IFDG model as a base. I don't have the IFDG model, or the UTT MD-11 so I can't compare the two.

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AND IT DOESN'T STOP THERE.
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UTT have taken it upon themselves to monetize their "hobby" by re-selling the 3DS files that they release for the AI community. Here are the links to these pages where they are making money from other people's work;

http://www.turbosquid.com/Search/Artists/paperscan
http://www.fspilotshop.com/united-traffic-team-m-444.html?osCsid=f05e0105d92b9a929969e1658bcf6c46
http://unitedtrafficteam.com/index.php/store1/3d-models-source/category/aviation

Not only that but there are paid advertisements targeting simmers, to drive sales of those packages out there.

 >:(

=====================================================================================================================
AND IT STILL DOESN'T STOP THERE.
=====================================================================================================================

There are a lot of worried modelers out there in the FS community looking at these pages and wondering why their aircraft look so similar in wireform. Some may be legitimate. Others may not be. I don't know yet. But having spoken to several others, this issue is not being taken lightly. I don't think we should take it lightly either.

There are some good freeware authors within UTT. Honest people. It's a shame for them to be involved in such a scam.

This web runs deeper than anybody knows. UTT have a long history with FS, esp. with Payware. I don't want to / can't mention too much about that because I don't have all the facts. But dig deep enough and you will make the connections. They are without a doubt 100% a business.

I would suggest that any files relating to the 747-8 and 732 be removed from Avsim and Flightsim. And I would urge UTT to remove them from their own site too.
As for all of us who already have these models, well, you have your own choices. Use them or don't. Personally I wouldn't want to line their pockets.  :rules:
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Offline Dominato83

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Re: READ: UTT DECOMPILING, MODIFYING AND SELLING AIA MODELS
« Reply #1 on: October 23, 2013, 01:37:38 AM »
One word: Sad

Offline Kyle M.

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Re: READ: UTT DECOMPILING, MODIFYING AND SELLING AIA MODELS
« Reply #2 on: October 23, 2013, 01:41:44 AM »
Incredibly saddening and disappointing to hear this, Andy, and thank you for your expert perspective. Your perspective is one I absolutely trust.

I know there is debate with the POSKY CRJ series compared to the UTT CRJ series as well, and thats been well documented on Hiroshi's facebook.

Everyone please note that the painters at FC75 had no idea that this was going on. Yes, we did paint and beta test the CRJ9 and CRJ1000 for UTT and I'm sure we would have never agreed to it knowing what we know now.

Sorry to stir the pot a little.

Kyle

« Last Edit: October 23, 2013, 01:43:20 AM by F18bkr »

Offline Northeastern292

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Re: READ: UTT DECOMPILING, MODIFYING AND SELLING AIA MODELS
« Reply #3 on: October 23, 2013, 03:05:09 AM »
Too upsetting. I'll stick to Train Sim and TF2 for a while...and send a letter of resignation to my VA while I'm at it.

At least the computer I built last summer isn't going to waste.
Sasha
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Offline jetsetterace

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Re: READ: UTT DECOMPILING, MODIFYING AND SELLING AIA MODELS
« Reply #4 on: October 23, 2013, 03:10:07 AM »
Only one word I can think of to describe this: Sad :(
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Offline pommy80

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Re: READ: UTT DECOMPILING, MODIFYING AND SELLING AIA MODELS
« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2013, 04:16:45 AM »
What's the difference between the ones they are selling and the ones that are available for free download? If it's nothing than it's a very sad act trying to rip off the fs community.
Daniel

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Offline Big777jet

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Re: READ: UTT DECOMPILING, MODIFYING AND SELLING AIA MODELS
« Reply #6 on: October 23, 2013, 04:28:52 AM »
Who will have to create start over again?  Will AIG teams guys will have to redesign 747-8i, CRJ-1000, Suskui 100 and etc possible Airbus 350? Who will take over? I was shocked  ::surprise:: you found many copycat from UTT teams stolen your copyright from AIG or else. 

Good luck with AIG teams will have to work on them on their own copyright new model coming up I guess they will release by late Spring or summer 2014. 

Thanks,

Stuart


Offline kramaxa

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Re: READ: UTT DECOMPILING, MODIFYING AND SELLING AIA MODELS
« Reply #7 on: October 23, 2013, 05:31:39 AM »
I officially declare UTT never  steal any model. That's all I wanted to say!
Max

« Last Edit: October 24, 2013, 03:34:55 AM by kramaxa »

Offline vadim

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Re: READ: UTT DECOMPILING, MODIFYING AND SELLING AIA MODELS
« Reply #8 on: October 23, 2013, 06:25:44 AM »
Dear Andy, who started the fire and inflamed everything around. I am not a modeler, so its impossible for me to judge others and their products especially. You can see coincidences in the UTT Boeing 737-200 and AI Aardvark 737-200. I don't. We have another very good model - FAIB. Could you make the same comparison between these THREE models (UTT, AIA and FAIB)? In this case IMO the differences and coincidences would be clearly visible. Thank You.

Offline delta64heavy

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Re: READ: UTT DECOMPILING, MODIFYING AND SELLING AIA MODELS
« Reply #9 on: October 23, 2013, 06:41:05 AM »
This really getting out of hand. All parties involved needs to just get together or whatever and resolve this issue. This really tiresome and ridiculous.  :nuke: Solve it, please.
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Offline RobW94

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Re: READ: UTT DECOMPILING, MODIFYING AND SELLING AIA MODELS
« Reply #10 on: October 23, 2013, 06:41:22 AM »
Dear Andy, who started the fire and inflamed everything around. I am not a modeler, so its impossible for me to judge others and their products especially. You can see coincidences in the UTT Boeing 737-200 and AI Aardvark 737-200. I don't. We have another very good model - FAIB. Could you make the same comparison between these THREE models (UTT, AIA and FAIB)? In this case IMO the differences and coincidences would be clearly visible. Thank You.

Stop there for one moment. You say you aren't a modeller so you can't really comment on this topic in the manner you have, talking down to Andy.

This is not just one guy saying this - top modellers are collectively coming to the same conclusion which for me is as good as gospel. I'm very upset and disgusted at the deceit from UTT and I will not be visiting their website/forums nor painting on their models anymore.

From reading the sources I have, modelling is somewhat similar to painting. Authors leave a stamp and when you encounter a copied paint the shapes/paths line up pixel perfect (like the mapping) and there is NO WAY in this world two painters could complete the same paint matching each other pixel perfect even if it's just one shape I'd be suspicious. For modelling though I suspect it's even more alarming when points match up perfectly as this is in 3D whereas a paint is 2D.
Robert Williams
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Offline heliosair

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Re: READ: UTT DECOMPILING, MODIFYING AND SELLING AIA MODELS
« Reply #11 on: October 23, 2013, 06:43:17 AM »
Okey for UTT 737-200 there is a great replacement from FAIB i can use.. but for FSX there is no other option for CRJ-900 or 747-800.
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Offline heliosair

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Re: READ: UTT DECOMPILING, MODIFYING AND SELLING AIA MODELS
« Reply #12 on: October 23, 2013, 06:51:10 AM »
Plus shouldnt it be between the modeller and UTT this war.. why did AIG and people from AIG get involved?
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Offline johanfrc

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Re: READ: UTT DECOMPILING, MODIFYING AND SELLING AIA MODELS
« Reply #13 on: October 23, 2013, 07:37:40 AM »
Wondering the same as Tamas. Where did AIG get involved in this?
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Johan Clausen

Offline vadim

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Re: READ: UTT DECOMPILING, MODIFYING AND SELLING AIA MODELS
« Reply #14 on: October 23, 2013, 07:44:47 AM »
Dear Andy, who started the fire and inflamed everything around. I am not a modeler, so its impossible for me to judge others and their products especially. You can see coincidences in the UTT Boeing 737-200 and AI Aardvark 737-200. I don't. We have another very good model - FAIB. Could you make the same comparison between these THREE models (UTT, AIA and FAIB)? In this case IMO the differences and coincidences would be clearly visible. Thank You.

Stop there for one moment. You say you aren't a modeller so you can't really comment on this topic in the manner you have, talking down to Andy.

This is not just one guy saying this - top modellers are collectively coming to the same conclusion which for me is as good as gospel. I'm very upset and disgusted at the deceit from UTT and I will not be visiting their website/forums nor painting on their models anymore.

From reading the sources I have, modelling is somewhat similar to painting. Authors leave a stamp and when you encounter a copied paint the shapes/paths line up pixel perfect (like the mapping) and there is NO WAY in this world two painters could complete the same paint matching each other pixel perfect even if it's just one shape I'd be suspicious. For modelling though I suspect it's even more alarming when points match up perfectly as this is in 3D whereas a paint is 2D.

First, be tolerant to others opinion which differs from Your one.
Talking about this particular case I am an interested person because in case of violation of so called "intellectual property" I will have to get rid of some very good (I say again -VERY GOOD) models which has no substitution right now.
Regards.